The Internet is the global system of interconnected computer networks that use the Internet protocol suite (TCP/IP) to link devices worldwide. It is a network of networks that consists of private, public, academic, business, and government networks.
The 3 Layers of The Internet:
ClearNet. The “World Wide Web,” Surface Web, ClearNet or simply referred to as the Web. Quite simply, the Surface Web refers to the portion of the internet only accessible by standard search engines – such as Yahoo, Bing and Google. While Google search results may feel endless at times and while you might think of them as being quite large in size, in reality, the Surface Web only consists of roughly 7% of the combined browse-able/accessible internet. Typically, it’s used for Email, Fax, File sharing, File transfer, Games, Instant messaging, Podcasts, Voice over IP, Searches, Streaming – etc.
To describe how it works, think about all of the web pages you can visit on your bank accounts homepage or email account. While all of those sites, links, addresses and emails technically exist on the internet, and while you can still search Google for Bank of America‘s website, this doesn’t mean you can search Google for the web pages associated with each Bank of America’s customers accounts. Nor can you search Google to find everyone elses emails hosted on Gmail – get it? Those web archives still exist on the internet all the same as their homepages, but are not indexed on the Surface Web to be publicly available – which is why we say they exist on the Deep Web, below the normal surface layer of the internet.
DarkNet. While the Deep Web is in reference to any site that cannot be accessed through traditional search engines, the “DarkNet” or “Dark Web” is a small portion of the Deep Web that has been intentionally hidden to hide in plain site, and is completely inaccessible via standard browsers and search methods. The DarkNet is by far the smallest layer of the Internet, estimated to consist of less than 40,000 websites in total – less than 1% of the browse-able internet.
Not only will you need to install a special type of software to access a DarkNet website, but the URL Address associated with it will almost certainly be encrypted with a randomized sequence of numbers and letters – literally making it impossible to find or type in by accident. Instead, you must know exactly what this sequence is – usually from someone else who already knows or has it. Even then, once there, you will also most likely need to enter a custom password in order to enter – making it virtually impossible to browse any DarkNet webpage without the proper permission.
As explained by CyberGuerrilla, DarkNet websites don’t rely on the IP/DNS system (typing mysite.org in a web browser will take you to an IP address like 10.11.12.13). Darknet websites are accessible only through networks such as Tor “The Onion Router” and I2P “Invisible Internet Project” and their respective software. Identities and locations of DarkNet users stay anonymous and cannot be tracked due to the layered encryption system. The DarkNet encryption technology routes users’ data through a large number of intermediate servers, which protects the users’ identity and guarantees anonymity. Due to the high level of encryption, websites are not able to track geo-location and IP of their users, and users are not able to get this information about the host; communication between DarkNet users is highly encrypted allowing users to talk, blog, and share files confidentially.
The DarkNet is also used for illegal activity such as illegal trade, forums, and media exchange, making it a prime target for Law Enforcement Agencies around the world. The 2 main DarkNet‘s networks are TOR (The Onion Router) and I2P ( Invisible Internet Project). While Tor focuses on providing anonymous access to the Internet, I2P specializes on allowing “anonymous” hosting of websites called “Eepsites.”
Active Darknets worth mentioning:
Freenet is a peer-to-peer platform for censorship-resistant communication. It uses a decentralized distributed data store to keep and deliver information, and has a suite of free software for publishing and communicating on the Web without fear of censorship
GNUnet another peer-to-peer network that offers users full link encryption.
Decentralized network 42 (not for anonymity but research purposes)
Syndie is software used to publish distributed forums over the anonymous networks of I2P, Tor and Freenet.
Riffle is a client-server Darknet system that provides secure anonymity and minimal bandwidth
Tor Browser and Tor-accessible sites are widely used among the Darknet users and can be identified by the domain (.onion). Servers configured to receive inbound connections only through Tor are called hidden services. Rather than revealing a server’s IP address (and thus its network location), a hidden service is accessed through its onion address,
The TOR Network works by bouncing your communications around a distributed network of relays (nodes) run by volunteers all around the world: it prevents somebody watching your Internet connection from learning what sites you visit, and it prevents the sites you visit from learning your physical location.
Tor passes your traffic through at least 3 different servers before sending it on to the destination. Encrypting your packets and bouncing them around the Internet isn’t cost less. All that extra work means that browsing the Web via Tor feels sluggish compared to using a conventional browser. Tor is not meant to completely solve the issue of anonymity on the web and is not designed to completely erase tracks but instead to reduce the likelihood for sites to trace actions and data back to the user. Users are also warned to use https versions of websites, not to use Tor over Tor, not to torrent with Tor, not to enable browser plugins, not to open documents downloaded through Tor while online, and to use safe bridges. Also, Bittorrent over Tor is not anonymous.
Projects Using TOR:
Tor Browser: https://www.torproject.org/projects/torbrowser.html.en – comes with a pre-configured web browser to protect your anonymity, and is self-contained (portable)
TAILS Operating System (Linux): https://tails.boum.org/about/index.en.html – Tails is a live system that aims to preserve your privacy and anonymity
Whonix Operating Systems (Linux): https://www.whonix.org/ – Whonix is a Debian GNU/Linux based security-focused Linux distribution. It aims to provide privacy, security and anonymity on the internet
Orbot (Tor for Android OS’s): https://guardianproject.info/apps/orbot/
Some links may be disturbing and dangerous to visit.
To avoid be tracked or watched online, I strongly recommend you to run a VPN service on the system that you access. VPN will give you a double layer protection against the unknown.
** DISCLAIMER: BEFORE YOU ACCESS THESE LINKS YOU SHOULD UNDERSTAND THAT SOME CONTENT PROVIDED ON THESE DEEP WEB LINKS MIGHT BE DISTURBING, UNPLEASANT OR FRAUDULENT. VISIT THEM AT YOUR OWN RISK. WE RECOMMEND TO USE THOSE DEEP WEB LINKS ONLY FOR RESEARCHING PURPOSES! WE ARE NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR ANY DAMAGE CAUSED BY YOUR ACTIONS! **
Some Popular TOR .onion Sites:
http://hss3uro2hsxfogfq.onion/ (notEvil search engine)
http://xmh57jrzrnw6insl.onion/ (TORCH search engine)
http://uhwikih256ynt57t.onion/wiki/index.php/Main_Page (Uncensored Hidden Wiki onion link)
http://answerstedhctbek.onion/ (uncensored General-subject Q&A forum)
http://torvps7kzis5ujfz.onion/ (VPSSHell .onion hosting)
http://grrmailb3fxpjbwm.onion/ (TorGuerrillaMail – Disposable Temporary E-Mail Address)
https://protonirockerxow.onion/ (Fully encrypted email hosted in Switzerland offering free accounts)
http://nzh3fv6jc6jskki3.onion/ – Riseup provides online communication tools for people and groups working on liberatory social change
http://tetatl6umgbmtv27.onion/ (Tor Chat roulette style service)
http://6dvj6v5imhny3anf.onion/ (CyberGuerrilla leAkboX)
http://76qugh5bey5gum7l.onion/status.xsl (Deep Web Radio)
http://deepdot35wvmeyd5.onion (DeepDotWeb -Surfacing the News)
http://grams7enufi7jmdl.onion (Search Grams)
http://kpynyvym6xqi7wz2.onion main.paraZite (Anarchy files and Underground)
http://valhallaxmn3fydu.onion (Valhalla Market)
http://silkkitiehdg5mug.onion (Silkkitie Market)
http://lchudifyeqm4ldjj.onion (Dream Market Dark Web Market)
http://direct.i2p/ (Direct Search)
http://forum.i2p (Main i2p Forum)
http://imgbi.i2p img.bi (Secure Image Hosting)
http://git.repo.i2p/ (Anonymous Git Hosting)
http://freedomforum.i2p/ (Privacy Forum)
http://leakager.i2p/ (A Cat’s Mirror of Wikileak)
General Chatter Putting In Perspective:
[Mink] oh, then go go go
[Mink] right, today we are going to talk about Darnets and TOR in particoular
[Mink] i made few notes to read to get us started
[Chanlog] Title: Riseup Pad (at pad.riseup.net)
[Mink] please, wait 10 minutes before starting to ask questions
[Mink] i’ll just write few points here while you read
[Mink] the Internet is big, really big
[Mink] what we think of the internet are webpages, blogs, email, instant messaging, webradio, voip (like skype) etc
[Mink] most of those services use the tcp/ip protocol to connect the resouces together
[amoruxX] When do we start ?
[RedAcor] Already started.
[Mink] oh amoruxX , we just did
[Mink] fundamental to make the internet work is the IP/dns concept, where a number (like 176.23.98) gets translated to a name (like mysite.com) and back
[Mink] this makes these resources available to the public and available to Search Engines (like google and yahoo)
[Mink] once a new website name is registered, a IP address is assigned to it
[Mink] this is what most people call “the internet” but there is much more
[Mink] there is a part most people will never see
[Mink] it is hidden on purpose
[B[U]G] where the address is assigned by your isp Internet Provider Service , where are two ip address ( public ) and ( local ) with mask subnet and principal gateway , the public have han UDP connetion to the internet call other service and TCP have an entrance connection to localhost
[Mink] imagine big companies networks, government agencies, or really anyone that doesn’t want their site or resources been indexed by search engines
[Mink] that we will call “DARKNET” or hidden web
[Mink] sorry “deepweb”
[Mink] deepweb/invisible/hidden, basically not available to the public
[Mink] unless you have a login/password or a very precise address
[Mink] the deepweb is the biggest part of the internet
[B[U]G] This is because it is not possible to search through a search engine because each address is generated randomly
[Mink] in the deepweb, there is a small portion that we can only see with “special software”
[Mink] that we will call “darknet”
[Mink] for today we will talk about the main Darknet networ, the TOR (onion) network
[Mink] with TOR software (like torbrowser) we can access the normal web AND the onion network
[Mink] onion sites end with .onion and use different protocols from the norm
[Mink] the TOR network anonimize both the user and the server, automatically
[Mink] as a user, your traffic will pass trough at least 3 different servers, before reaching the target site
[n1ck1] what are the names of the different protocols for me to look for later?
[B[U]G] thanks to a connection called “onion”, by most users who share the relay
[n1ck1] ok tks
[n1ck1] I need t reed more about socks
[Mink] all the traffic from those servers (called “nodes” or “relay nodes” is encrypted
[Mink] making using the tor network slower than normal
[Mink] surfing the web is the main use of TOR, but it can be used to send/receive mail, IRC (like i’nm doing right now) or even voip (IF YOU CAN GET A FAST CONNECTION
[Aeolus] you can voip through tor?
[Mink] yes, with a bit of luck
[Aeolus] cool, didnt know that
[Mink] TOR can be used pretty much like any other proxy
[Mink] u could plug it in Thunderbird for emails
[Mink] in Hexchat for IRC
[B[U]G] using the gpg encryption with thunderbird or claws mail for more security
[Mink] in Mozilla for ftp, etc
[n1ck1] voip + “proxuchains firefox(TOR)”
[n1ck1] three at a time, using a VPN to open the terminal with the configured proxychains and run the TOR browser??
[Arkhangel] why with torrent no, p2p
[Mink] no, but you can use vpn+TOR
[Aeolus] like me
[n1ck1] why not proxychains too?
[n1ck1] tor first or VPN first?
[B[U]G] proxychains is a simple script
[Aeolus] vpn then tor
[Aeolus] for me
[B[U]G] tht filter tor
[Aeolus] others prefer elseway
[Mink] Bittorrent over Tor is not anonymous, becouse needs to aware of other seeds/leecher sharing the files
[B[U]G] you can use for launch any application
[l0t3D_] what difference does it make
[Mink] also would put too much stress on the network
[Arkhangel] Aeolus, if someone uses TOR then VPN, I dont think he can access to onion network xD
[l0t3D_] Mink how do you even Bittorrent over tor?
[Mink] so p2p with TOR: possible, but really a waste of time
[n1ck1] yeah…rsrsrs I see
[B[U]G] l0t3D_, set tor as proxy socks
[B[U]G] or http
[B[U]G] or generate
[Mink] again, it’s just possible to plug TOR port in your client
[B[U]G] iptables rules
[n1ck1] VPN + TOR is the best right?
[Mink] yes n1ck1
[Arkhangel] Mink do u mean that seeders/leechers should know your real IP?
[B[U]G] the best configuration are , tor – vpn – tor ,
[Mink] but now.. the bad part
[Aeolus] Arkhangel i used to be able to do that especially with my whonix settings
[l0t3D_] so to “torrent over tor” you need to plug TOR into my bittorent client
[Aeolus] i talk about normal browsing when you want to use tor as an extra layer
[Arkhangel] Aeolus U think that the best configuration is the config shown by B[U]G XD
[l0t3D_] but if i torrent normally and TOR is running that’s okay right?
[Mink] yes Arkhangel ,serius bitorrent users should use proxies or VPNs , not TOR
[Aeolus] Arkhangel xD
[Mink] yes l0t3D_
[Arkhangel] what is the bad part? Mink
[Mink] ok, let me make one more point, then u free to ask questionbs
[Mink] right, bad part is TOR is not perfect
[n1ck1] a few days ago they tracked the IP of many users
[Mink] and it’s been under scrutiny for vulnerabilies for years
[Arkhangel] I think* (I wrong to write before lol)
[Mink] “”Tor is not meant to completely solve the issue of anonymity on the web and is not designed to completely erase tracks but instead to reduce the likelihood for sites to trace actions and data back to the user””
[Mink] there are ways and attacks to “deanonimize” a small portion of TOR users
[B[U]G] for example
[Aeolus] like FBI running nodes
[B[U]G] a plugin
[B[U]G] in browser
[B[U]G] you can deanonymize you
[Mink] ” Users are also warned to use https versions of websites, not to use Tor over Tor, not to torrent with Tor, not to enable browser plugins, not to open documents downloaded through Tor while online, and to use safe bridges.”
[Arkhangel] how a plugin can do this?
[l0t3D_] Aeolus do they?
[Aeolus] yes ofc they do
[B[U]G] or you find it on an exit node,
[Mink] the NSA is known to have run TOR “nodes” , also known as a man-in-the-middle attack
[n1ck1] TOR over TOR?
[l0t3D_] Tor over Tor? Mink
[Mink] never tor-over-tor
[l0t3D_] hahaha n1ck1
[l0t3D_] how do you even TOR over TOR
[n1ck1] so far so goof rsrsrs
[Mink] that would be running 2 instances of TOR
[Arkhangel] in which manner TOR over TOR can make u not anon?
[l0t3D_] Mink tor stops you from doing that
[n1ck1] like in the real machine and the VM use TOR?
[Mink] it’s like an internal thing, the “relay” will just not work, 2 likely result, no traffic go trogh, or worse no encryption between the relays
[n1ck1] I’m going to print this
[Mink] if you don’t like the 3 “hops” of a standard TOR connection, you can ofcourse increase it
[forceMajeure] the problem with using tor to browse is that 99 out of 100 people will deanonymize themselves by accident without ever realizing it. User error
[Arkhangel] n1ck1 this lesson will be printed later
[Arkhangel] n1ck1 u can access it on the site of cg
[B[U]G] you can use a gateway into your vm as whonix , then use a vpn on you local machine host , and reuse tor setting of your vm gateway
[Mink] ok, now, to cover my ass
[n1ck1] ok thanks Arkhangel
[Mink] WARNING: BEFORE YOU ACCESS THESE LINKS YOU SHOULD UNDERSTAND THAT SOME CONTENT PROVIDED ON THESE DEEP WEB LINKS MIGHT BE DISTURBING, UNPLEASANT OR FRAUDULENT.
[Mink] VISIT THEM AT YOUR OWN RISK.
[Arkhangel] forceMajeure how an user can realize it?
[n1ck1] ok….send please
[Mink] you can see from the list at the bottom of the pad
[Mink] there is a bit of everything
[Mink] email services, blogs, forums, chats
[forceMajeure] lets say you visit your own website, log into ANY account associated with your real identity, attack a cpu of someone you know, just little things
[Arkhangel] forceMajeure and what are the user errors that bring the user to be deanonymized?
[Aeolus] use tor to log to FB
[forceMajeure] look up
[Mink] of course all end in .onion, and using a normal browser won’t work
[Aeolus] something stupid like that
[Arkhangel] forceMajeure ah ok… this should answer to my second question
[forceMajeure] turn on js to access a site, etc.
[Arkhangel] forceMajeure why if I use js to access a site, I m not anon anymore? js stores my real IP over TOR?
[Mink] remember, and this is for clearnet aswell, your browser is the single most dangerous point of failure
[forceMajeure] if the site is compromised, someone can use something like burp to insert a malicios js
[forceMajeure] they did it at defcon years ago
[forceMajeure] you should always be using noscript
[Mink] ok, questions, and please let me answer first before giving your opinion
* Aeolus agrees with Mink
[Arkhangel] forceMajeure so if I am on TOR network, if I go on a onion malicious website and I click where I have to not click, this malicious js can decrypt the routing information to get my real IP?
[Mink] yes Arkhangel
[n1ck1] Is it set by default to accept or reject scripts?
[Arkhangel] sorry but, at this point
[n1ck1] TOR Browser
* Aeolus thinks we all tell shit and not let Mink who knows educate us
[Arkhangel] why didnt they do a strong encryption?
[Arkhangel] that cannot be decrypted?
[Mink] even worse, it can inject code into your browser, activate your webcam and mic, take screen shots and much more, no kidding
[forceMajeure] true story
[Arkhangel] not inverse hash algorithms
[Arkhangel] not invertible*
[Mink] nothing to do with encryption, JS runs on your computer, not the server
[Arkhangel] Mink if I click on a js hosted on an onion website, it runs on my pc?
[B[U]G] you can
[Mink] not only .onion
[Aeolus] js runs client-side
[B[U]G] and disable WebRTC leak
[B[U]G] on you browser settings
[Arkhangel] good to know XD
[Arkhangel] I have other different questions
[Arkhangel] the onion websites store the (false) IP of each user accessing to it?
[m00trix] Let’s just agree on that TOR is great. If used out of the “box” the TOR Browser will in most cases keep you safe. If you decide to disable or allow sites through the build in TOR Browser plugins, you are taking a risk that not even TOR, nor any other level of anon tools can protect you from.
[RedAcor] For webrtc settings: https://www.privacytools.io/#webrtc
[Chanlog] Title: Privacy Tools – Encryption Against Global Mass Surveillance (at http://www.privacytools.io)
[B[U]G] or simply edit your about:config asd
[Arkhangel] Mink, if today TOR gives me a certain IP address, tomorrow or after a month, another user of another part of the world can be assigned to that same IP?
[B[U]G] to http.refer and media.peer connection
[m00trix] Arkhangel, yes that is the hole point…
[B[U]G] how all – all store a log , depends if the owner delete it
[Arkhangel] m00trix why “hole point”?
[m00trix] if 200 users on that exit node
[m00trix] with the same “ip”
[B[U]G] but the node change every time
[m00trix] you get plausible deniability
[Arkhangel] is it a problem if an IP assigned by TOR is used in the future by another user?
[m00trix] its a bonus
[Arkhangel] ah ok xD
[Mink] again, TOR will not give you an IP address, but an “identity”
[m00trix] yea Mink
[Arkhangel] Ok Mink so that “IP” address does not work on IP protocol?
[m00trix] I think he means when using the browser, it tells the exit nodes ip
[Arkhangel] yes, in practice
[l0t3D_] okay so if i have scripts disabled globally but lets say i enable it only on youtube to play a video
[n1ck1] how many connections can a node make with the same IP
[Mink] yes Arkhangel , TOR architecture does not use the same IP ]DNS as normal internet
[m00trix] that IP is your source proxy IP when browsing trough the TOR browser
[m00trix] or using any service to proxy through it
[n1ck1] and how many users can be on the node at the same time?
[l0t3D_] could another malicious website use that youtube tab to attack me?
[Mink] when a new .onion site is created it doesn’t get a IP address, but a .omnion address
[n1ck1] sorry…. my mistake
[n1ck1] but a node can handle how many requests?
[n1ck1] and perform how many for another node?
[B[U]G] all it’s possible this it happens if youtube link it’s embedded in page builded ad hoc
[m00trix] Mink, still, when you use the TOR Browser, it will tell you what the exit nodes IP is when you start it. That exit node IP is also the source of the browser requests you make and the source of any program you proxy trough it
[Arkhangel] Mink in practice you are saying that, unlike normal internet where a service like a website is on the 3rd level (IP level ISO/OSI), the onion network is completely on the 7th level (application level) of the
[Mink] ok, to spend those few minutes: TOR isn’t the only darknet network
[m00trix] okay stop
[l0t3D_] if it’s a normal youtube link i opened myself B[U]G?
[B[U]G] depends if in source
[B[U]G] a function
[m00trix] When you are using the TOR browser, to go on midgetporn.org or whatever. Midgetporn.org will see your source IP as the exit nodes public IP
[B[U]G] a malicious “file”
[B[U]G] or host
[m00trix] simple as that
[Aeolus] guys thanks for today info. i suppose logs will be up later so i can read again, got to go.
[Aeolus] good work Mink thx 🙂
[Mink] you welcome Aeolus
[Arkhangel] in practice m00trix your machine is overlapped on the exit node
[l0t3D_] but if there is nothing in this source but there is a malicious “file” in another tab i have opened in the same time but I have no scripts enabled?
[m00trix] fire up the TOR browser, and press the “test tor…” thingy
[forceMajeure] Is it possible for tor to assign you a new circuit while an existing connection is still established say through a python script ran through port 9050
[B[U]G] for example : [script src=”DownloadThisEvilCode.js”/] [iframe]youtube embedd[/iframe]
[Mink] Arkhangel, , you want to rephase your question?
[forceMajeure] thus severing the connection
[m00trix] any site that want’s to can see the visitors source IP – and with TOR browser, that source IP is the IP of the current exit node your are on.
[Arkhangel] Mink, about the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OSI_model
[Chanlog] Title: OSI model – Wikipedia (at en.wikipedia.org)
[m00trix] really pretty simple
[Mink] yes forceMajeure , not only possible, but advisable, tor will change nodes randomly to add anonimity
[Mink] Arkhangel, i know the OSi model :/
[forceMajeure] but what happens to the connection that was established before the circuit changes
[Arkhangel] Mink, if the normal websites have associated IP
[forceMajeure] is it passed into the new connection
[Arkhangel] so the 3rd level of OSI model
[Arkhangel] the onion network, since it does not have IP, it is completely on the application level of OSI model?
[forceMajeure] I guess I could see what happens by sending newnym to 9051 I just thought of that
[Arkhangel] since it does not have IP ( i mean the onion websites)
[Mink] no Arkhangel
[m00trix] you need to not compare hosting an onion site with using the TOR browser
[Mink] lets’ amke it clear TOR and TORbrowser are 2 different things
[m00trix] I think Mink covered all the questions really good already
[Arkhangel] in the pad
[Mink] torbrowser connects to tor
[Arkhangel] it talks about the Freenet platform
[Arkhangel] continue xD I was thinking u finished to answer my prev question xD
[Arkhangel] ok so torbroweser, application level, connects to TOR network
[Mink] yes, trough socks
[Arkhangel] socks is an application protocol?
[Mink] taht’s 5 i think
[Arkhangel] ah ok
[m00trix] Arkhangel, you need to unleash your mind from that OSI layer shit 😀
[Arkhangel] ok xD
[n1ck1] socks is a protocol right? the TOR Browser is the application?
[Mink] yes n1ck1 , but it’s easy to confuse “an application(like a program) and the “application layer” of the stack
[Mink] so yes
[Arkhangel] tell me when I can continue with another question
[m00trix] Arkhangel, if you fire up a VM with like parrotsec.org OS – It have a build in function that routes all traffic through TOR. There are other distros that does this as well. But any way, if you do that, you can look into how the traffic flows using the terminal – when all traffic is routed using TOR. Might give you more insight
[l0t3D_] i dont know if this is related to this lesson or not but what are Obfuscated servers?
[l0t3D_] or “obfs”
[Arkhangel] m00trix traceroute?
[forceMajeure] lsof -i -n -P
[m00trix] well for a start heh
[m00trix] and many more
[Arkhangel] ah ok
[m00trix] but it will show you the traffic flow
[Arkhangel] nice to know
[Mink] one thing i wanted to talk about, but we have no time, whonix
[Arkhangel] another doubt is: since ISP knows what I am visiting as website, if I access to an onion website, my ISP can know it?
[vivek] m00trix: you can achieve the same with almost any distro
[m00trix] and if there are like 200 others using the same exit node that you are on, for that current TOR connection – it’s all good.
[m00trix] vivek, I know
[Mink] the ISP will know you are using TOR, but not which sites you are visiting
[Arkhangel] Mink the ISP cannot know the onion address?
[vivek] Parrot one is highly unstable and my exp. Was not very good
[m00trix] And if you combine TOR with an OpenVPN on port 443 then even less
[Arkhangel] Mink it because ISP can see destination IP but onion website are not based on IP scheme? this is the reason?
[Arkhangel] or one of the reasons
[m00trix] vivek, I only have a VM with it. But yes, it’s Debian aka unstable heh
[Mink] no Arkhangel , unless the ISp is running the last TOR exit node
[Arkhangel] normally, an ISP in the clearnet precisely what can see from me? Only the IP of website that I am visiting?
[m00trix] Arkhangel, your ISP cant see what sites your are browsing trough TOR
[l0t3D_] [l0t3D_] i dont know if this is related to this lesson or not but what are Obfuscated servers?
[l0t3D_] [l0t3D_] or “obfs”
[m00trix] all your DNS lookups and what you are doing
[m00trix] if you use the ISP’s dns servers
[Mink] in clearnet, your IS know your favourite pornhub page
[Arkhangel] guys so the ISP can read only the DNS lookup table inside the router?
[m00trix] they can see all, but not https login data
[Arkhangel] ah ok
[Mink] sorry l0t3D_ , obfuscated are another kinfd of “relay nodes” to help tranport info
[m00trix] Arkhangel, if you use the DNS servers provided by the ISP you have. They can see what sites you visit, the IP of the sites, what traffic you generate, they can see close to anything
[l0t3D_] obfuscated servers are used to access vpn or tor in some places like the great firewall of china?
[Arkhangel] cannot I change the DNS server where I want to go?
[Mink] yes l0t3D_ , and Iran and N korea
[l0t3D_] well i think ill be up on that list soon too
[Arkhangel] provided by other companies?
[m00trix] If you change the DNS servers on your router to some that does not log and are not your ISP’s. They loose the ability to view your DNS req
[l0t3D_] thath’s the only way i can access tor or vpn
[m00trix] next step is then, VPN and TOR
[Arkhangel] m00trix so you mean that then internet in my location does not work lol
[l0t3D_] makes the connection very f’in slow tho
[m00trix] I would advice any one to NOT use the default ISP provided DNS servers as a pure basic step
[m00trix] should be the first step you do on the router
[Mink] l0t3D_, remember for help with anonimity and privacy you can always ask in #opnewblood, we will be happy to help with that
[Arkhangel] m00trix how can we do this?
[m00trix] set WAN DNS to manual and find some good non logging DNS
[Arkhangel] do u know some non logging DNS?
[m00trix] Arkhangel, depends on what router you have
[l0t3D_] thanks Mink
[m00trix] Also you will get arround of most censorship
[m00trix] by stat step alone
[Arkhangel] can you list some of them here?
[m00trix] gov dns blocks
[m00trix] I switch it up
[m00trix] but run
[l0t3D_] should i call them and ask them nicely to change my DNS? 🙂
[m00trix] some places
[m00trix] just login to your router
[m00trix] and change it
[m00trix] if in doubt give me a priv
[Arkhangel] ty very much
[l0t3D_] WAN settings right?
[m00trix] and then
[m00trix] set DNS do manual
[m00trix] not the IP 😀
[m00trix] only dns
[Arkhangel] another question: the pad talks about the freenet platform… is it a software to be installed on my computer?
[Mink] yes Arkhangel
[m00trix] l0t3D_, priv me if you need help
[Arkhangel] what is the difference between freenet platform sw and tor bundle sw?
[m00trix] If I run with my basic ISP DNS servers sites like http://1337x.to/ are blocked 🙂 a torrent site. Gov block
[Chanlog] Title: Torrent Search Engine | 1337x.to (at 1337x.to)
[n1ck1] if I change my DNS the VOIP stops working in my house
[Arkhangel] or better: if torbrowser allows me to access to the tor network, freenet and other shown platforms on pad, what do they allow me to do?
[m00trix] wut n1ck1?
[m00trix] makes no sence
[n1ck1] my ISP has a separate physical VOIP phone but connected by cable to the router
[n1ck1] minha mae é velha e não sabe usar muitas tecnologias e o telefone é similar ao antigo porém funciona como VOIP
[n1ck1] my mother is old and does not know how to use many technologies and the phone is similar to the old one but it works like VOIP
[n1ck1] if I switch to any other, VOIP does not work, it has been months of technical visits, tests, and unsolvable configurations.
[RedAcor] Set DNS on your network manager.
[RedAcor] So that will not affect your router.
[RedAcor] Also you can use unbound on your system.
[RedAcor] You can check lesson 4 logs for that.
[m00trix] thx to Mink for a great course 🙂
[RedAcor] There many different and hybrid solutions.
[RedAcor] Anyways. Mink Thanks for delicious lesson. 🙂
[Arkhangel] guys is better vpn tor vpn tor or tor vpn tor?
[Arkhangel] is better starting with vpn or tor?
[n1ck1] This worked …. It’s simple but I had not thought of it.
[RedAcor] Arkhangel Tor VPN Tor
[Arkhangel] why starting with tor RedAcor?
[RedAcor] Some people use VPN ] VPN ] Tor also
[RedAcor] Because it is secure than VPN. jijiji
[n1ck1] tails pendrive, VPN, TOR, break everything later and throw it in the trash lol
[Arkhangel] instead, when I connect to tor network, when I reach the exit node, the IP of my computer is in clear there?
[RedAcor] If i talk about last bug of TOR: Nah.
[l0t3D_] 2 tor?
[m00trix] Arkhangel, really depends what you are doing also 🙂
[l0t3D_] [RedAcor] Arkhangel Tor VPN Tor
[n1ck1] RedAcor thanks for the DNS tip
[RedAcor] But they fixed that issue.
[RedAcor] n1ck1 You’re welcome.
[Arkhangel] to discover some user, agency like NSA what look for?
[Arkhangel] they use only their exit node and check for all users that go in, or they can know information also about exit node that are not theirs?
[m00trix] hard to say
[m00trix] you need to stop overthinking it
[Arkhangel] im afraid to forget these questions and these doubts xD
[m00trix] I get that bro. But I can’t answer you how the FEDS, CIA or NSA track people on TOR 🙂
[m00trix] or if they even can and with what success
[Arkhangel] dont worry. I have a last question: why tor works on SOCKS and not HTTP/HTTPS protocol?
[m00trix] Arkhangel, per design I think
[Arkhangel] in the network settings, for HTTP/HTTPS I cannot use the 9050 or 9150 port to use TOR, right?
[m00trix] network settings for what?
[Arkhangel] for example if you want to use a proxy on the system of the operating system
[m00trix] what OS Arkhangel
[m00trix] You want to route all traffic out through TOR
[Arkhangel] windows or linux-based
[Arkhangel] in that case for HTTP/HTTPS I cannot use port 9150
[Aspire] i have to go bye all and thanks for the lesson
[Arkhangel] since SOCKS and HTTP/HTTPS talk different “languages”
[m00trix] Arkhangel, are you trying to run another browser through TOR?
[m00trix] what are you trying to do, that would help heh
[Arkhangel] I want to use just the normal browser with no opening torbrowser
[Arkhangel] but where I can surf on tor
[m00trix] you have to have the TOR Browser running to proxy the traffic
[m00trix] unless you run a plain tor from a terminal
[Arkhangel] on windows I should run tor browser
[m00trix] and there is a reason for why the TOR browser is at is is. And have the plugins it have
[m00trix] to protect you
[m00trix] you can do what you are trying to do, but even TOR warns against it
[Arkhangel] i know that torbrowser is better for that, but just for information, if I start torbrowser and I enable a proxy that route the data to the tor network by a normal browser, it is not a connection tor over tor right?
[m00trix] when you start the TOR browser, you can tell most programs yo use 127.0.0.1:9150 as a proxy and it will proxy over TOR
[m00trix] but on Windows, the TOR Browser needs to be running
[Arkhangel] exactly, so it is simple one tor connection, is not tor over tor, right?
[Arkhangel] in case of windows I mean
[m00trix] tor over tor?
[Arkhangel] y, since it s not a good idea running tor over tor, I would like to know if, on windows, open torbrowser and proxying the other programs to 127.0.0.1:9150 is not a tor over tor
[l0t3D_] alright thanks all for the lesson i need to go
[n1ck1] not is
[Arkhangel] ok ty
[Arkhangel] Im so sorry I forced everyone to run away
[n1ck1] you only configure that program to use this network
[n1ck1] but use linux
[n1ck1] windows sucks
[Arkhangel] I use Linux, but I need to have all possible information
[n1ck1] try ubunto first, it is easy
[n1ck1] this is right
[Arkhangel] culture is power
[n1ck1] tks all